Metroid Prime: Federation Force Flops on UK Debut

Disappointing. Very disappointing...

I was considering picking it up, but given I rarely play online and don't live near any other 3DS users, I got Axiom Verge instead for cheaper. I may pick it up at some point in the future for cheaper, just to go on the shelf with the other Metroid games in my collection.

If only Federation Force had come out in 2012, it would've been highly anticipated, like Hunters was back in 2006, and sold well.

It's a shame as it really is a good game. I got to sit down and play it this weekend. First time into the Metroid franchise and I am now very interested in playing the rest of them.

Nintendo have buried Star Fox and Metroid in half a year, which is an achievement in itself.

Metroid fans be like:

EDIT: though I should say something with substance. I haven't gotten the game yet myself, mainly because I need to stop buying games that I'm not going to get to straight away. But it does look fun, so I'm for sure going to get it sometime down the road. Shame it's not performing well, even if it comes as no surprise.

Again, just like how it bombed in Japan this is hardly surprising. This is what happens when you make Metroid Prime: Frankenstein Farce and not what the fans want.

@Raylax there seems to have been problems with some companies getting stock.

"Dear Customer,

We are contacting you as we have been informed that this pre-order will be delayed until next week, this is due to the problems at the channel tunnel that has delayed the stock arriving with us. If you do not wish to wait for the item we can cancel this pre-order for you.

We apologise for this unfortunate issue"

Good, good. Everything's going according to plan.

As I've said before... it's the wrong timing for a game like this... they need to revive the main series before they can start playing around with spin-offs.

Sales seem to be going down quite quickly for 3DS games. Perhaps an NX reveal is due?

@ThomasBW84 it will all depends on who was supplying and also who Nintendo shipped stuff to first.

This would be on my to-buy list if I had the funds for games...Alas, this is not a good year for me, financially. I cannot support the games I want to support. It pains me to see them flopping like this. Starfox most of all.

@EllenJMiller Same, picked up Axiom Verge instead and I'll get round to FF somewhere down the line.

@Crimzonlogic Star Fox Zero got what it deserved just like MP: FF has.

@ThomasBW84 I went into my local GAME and there was only 1 copy (there were plenty of display boxes in the store but only 1 actual copy of the game which I bought). I imagine a similar situation happening with Color Splash, especially if the NX is revealed before launch date.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE Meh, I disagree. They both look like a ton of fun. People are so quick to slam things that aren't exactly what they were expecting...

@SLIGEACH_EIRE Not comparable. SFZ is more of a Star Fox game than Adventures and Assault ever were, even if it does have a couple of issues. The problems with Federation Force are of a different nature altogether. I'd argue that they are polar opposites, even, they flopped for entirely different reasons.

@RupeeClock Adding to that point, I seem to recall Super Metroid pops up here and there at times, particularly on the Wii U side of the eShop IIRC.

Why is it so hard to give fans what they want?

Because fans are not unified.

Some love the lore but want something fresh gameplay wise. Some want more of the same.

No matter what they do, someone will be upset.

Most want HD graphics, which is the biggest problem. A lot of people complained about the aesthetics of this game. Better graphics cost more money, and is the most costly part of games, sending AAA budgets into double and triple digits of millions of dollars.

That's why nintendo is all about mario and zelda, which are worth the investment. Look at reactions to the star fox zero graphics. People will not accept graphics that do not blow away the previous gen but will buy $60 worth of super metroid!

Nintendo has no choice but to ruin these series's to make them appeal to casuals just to make the investment worthwhile.

@MarcelRguez No, I'm saying SFZ deserved to fail as does MP: FF. I'm not comparing how true they are to their own respective franchises. SFZ deserved its failure because its controls were rotten, it was a lazy, rushed effort with no online support, no multiplayer of any kind. Co-op is different. With both games, they didn't listen to the fans.

I've been against federation force since it's announcement. I'm not happy it failed, I'm just frustrated about the situation we keep finding ourselves in with these old beloved franchises

A shame really, it deserves better. It's a fun game.

@jimi
I'm sure they know what the fans want, but it's likely not a profitable venture. Prime 4 is just too risky

@jimi That logic doesn't hold. Believe it or not, Nintendo is not tone-deaf to criticism. They are very aware of why a particular game was well or badly received. If they decide to can the series, it won't be for that asinine reason.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE Again, not comparable. SFZ was a game tailored to fans of the series, its only problem (which I don't really consider that big of a deal) was the controls. I'm guessing you're of the opinion that just because of that it deserves to fail, but again, remember Adventures, Assault and Command. It's a step in the right direction.

@khaosklub For what it's worth it wouldn't cost much if any more to have a better art style.

@Grandpa_Pixel I'm sorry this had to be your first Metroid game. Because it is not a Metroid game.

@RupeeClock
Here's the issues with a home console version:
1 wiiu's small user base
2 wiiu's higher resolution, so a greater than $50 million budget
3 people would demand it look better than prime 3, like the complaints levied against the star fox zero trailer
4 there is no way it could turn a profit. I don't think there are even enough wiiu's!

I bought it. It's an okay game. But I could not find a single other player online. Now I know why. I guess I'll just have to go though it on my own :/

Matter of fact I am thinking about not getting it for now and cancel my preorder. This game should become a bargain very soon.

@Vincent294
You gotta pay the artist to design the aesthetic, then the modellers spend more time trying to recreate the style in 3D, all assets must be reviewed and revised. Significant cost involved

@yoshinatsu
A lot of people feel that way about the entire prime series

Shame, it's a solid spin-off. Unfortunetly i think the bad press (justified or not) stopped alot of people from giving it a proper chance. Oh well, you win some you lose some.

Well, that certainly comes as a surprise... Oh, wait...

@MarcelRguez The controls are a big deal, they're the gateway to interacting with the game. They should be intuitive, not asking you to learn a whole new language for just one game. Besides the controls, the game is still mediocre, it should have had online multiplayer. Imagine Splatoon released with no online, just the single player campaign, it too would have bombed.

Nintendo don't care, they're just going through the motions with Wii U. That's why we got turdips like Animal Crossing, amiibo Festival, Mario Tennis: Ultra Smash, Mario & Friends: amiibo Challenge. And why the Wii U was ignored in the recent Direct. Its one great game left is no longer a Wii U exclusive and we have to wait for it because of the NX.

I just don't understand why they STILL haven't made a 2D game in the style of Super/Zero Mission/Fusion in TWELVE years. Maybe a game such as that wouldn't have topped the charts, but you'd have to think that a decent amount of people would buy it. It just seems like a perfect fit for the 3DS, instead of them trying to make 3D games that utilise the Metroid name that would be better suited for a home console release.

@khaosklub True. While most Prime games are very good, I don't consider them true Metroid games as Samus is handicapped in them compared to her 2D outings. They should try and find a balance between third person and a first person view. Retro originally tried third person but couldn't handle it, so it was switched to first person. In the right hands I believe it can be done brilliantly. But I don't think Retro are as great as they once were, they've lost a tonne of talent and have been stuck making 2D Donkey Kong games for ages. Their output is incredibly slow. They made 1 game for Wii U and just 2 true games for Wii, then there's the other bits like Trilogy, the DS version of Kong and helping out on MK.

@khaosklub Eh. I had played Super Metroid before. It was glorious. But years later, when I played Metroid Prime, I thought it was the greatest transition of a gaming series from 2D to 3D. Didn't even feel like I was playing a different game. This was still as Metroid as it could be. Almost 15 years later, I still believe that.

@yoshinatsu
It is a great transition, but it's certainly not the same

@jimi According to VGChartz, Metroid Prime 3 sold around 1.8 million copies. Other M, it sold another 1.4 million. I wouldn't really call them "flops".

@jimi Are you saying I don't like the Prime games? Where did I say that? I never said that.

@locky-mavo It's the game that will probably kill Metroid for many years to come. Hell no, I'm not letting this go.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE Honestly, that's you being lazy with your games. That used to be the norm, not the "one-size fits all" control schemes by genre we have nowadays. The media is very quick to bash a game because of its unconventional control scheme. Wonderful 101 comes to mind, everyone sucks the first time they play that game. In fact, most of PG's games can be used as an example of that.

You can do some crazy things in Star Fox Zero once you've mastered the controls. There's speedruns of people getting every medal in a little over two hours. The fact that this can be done consistently means that the controls are not broken, as the vocal majority says. For sure, they are a barrier of entry, but again, that's the case with many games independently of their quality.

Besides that, it's a bit hard to say that the game is mediocre when it has so few competitors. I can only think of Star Wars Battlefront and some Ratchet & Clank sections when it comes to games similar to SFZ. I get the complaints about the lack of a vs. mode, but the people that want SF to have online dog-fighting are forgetting what kind of game we're talking about here.

Big revelation, Star Fox is a 3D shmup. It's not a Star Wars game or Ace Combat, it's much more arcadey in nature. It would be nice to have such an extra mode, but to act like its absence is a fatal flaw is nonsense. Might as well complaint about the lack on-foot missions.

@jimi I don't think making up extreme views supports your backwards argument. I completely agree with what he said and I love the Prime games regardless.

@yoshinatsu Don't bother. He had this same discussion on another thread with other people and he didn't cave in despite people bringing up solid points against his headcanon.

@jimi
"Why is it so hard to give fans what they want?

Because fans are not unified.

Some love the lore but want something fresh gameplay wise. Some want more of the same."

This quote from my original post explains why "fans" didn't buy prime 2 or 3 to an extent. Many "fans" who liked the prime games like the lore, but want new experiences. They liked prime because it was something new. Prime 2 was more of the same.

Then there are fans who want more of the same. These are split into 2 major camps. Those who want more 2D metroid, and those who want more Prime, with some overlap. The fanbase is heavily divided, while before, there was only classic 2D metroid, so lore and gameplay fans had only one choice, and all metroid fans were united.

Like I says we never ask for a Federation Force and we definitely ain't buying it. It may be a good shooter but at the end of the day, it's just a spinoff and not a spinoff that was released to pass the time so a main 3DS Metroid would come but a spinoff that come at a time when everyone expect a main entry instead. If Federation Force is the only Metroid thing on 3DS, then Nintendo had just miss a great opportunity with the Metroid IP for 3DS.

@yoshinatsu
Other M pretty much did it too, but this was the game where nintendo told us that they know better than us, pretty directly, in a direct.

Based on reviews, Metroid Prime: Federation Force is a quality game.

So naturally, Nintendo fans remind Nintendo that they don't want quality games, they want what they want.

The Metroid IP was just drop into the fault, and will be forgotten. And that's where the fans told Nintendo where to put it.

Being one of those in the UK who did actually purchase Metroid Prime: Federation Force, I find the lack of success this game has had to be a real shame. I have admittedly only played through the first four missions (both online and offline) as well as a few rounds of Blast Ball, but I find it to be great so far.

The game controls well, particularly thanks to wonderful gyroscope aiming, and fights are fast paced and frantic. I'm surprised at both the amount of challenge this game throws at you from 2nd mission onwards, as well as how beautiful this game looks on the 3DS. The trailers don't do it justice; the game looks much better when played on the 3DS.

Again, I haven't gotten too far, but I'd so far certainly recommend it to others if they have a 3DS.

@XCWarrior
People don't play games because they are high quality games, they play them because they like them.

If someone dislikes first person shooter games, no level of quality will win them over. This isn't so much the case here, but illustrates the point.

It's about knowing your audience. The smartest thing for them to do is to play off nostalgia, which mario and zelda will do forever, giving more of the same, or create new IP's like splatoon.

@XCWarrior Based on reviews, Metroid Prime: Federation Force is a meh game.
So naturally, Nintendo fans remind Nintendo that they don't want meh games, they want what they want.
The Metroid IP was just drop into the fault. And that's where Nintendo put it.

Fixed that for you.

The answer is to stop making crapy spin off or micro games. We wanted metroid prime 4 we got fed force, we wanted a new starfox we got another remake, and so the story goes on! I believe when the NX comes along this promblem will be solved as all Dev teams will be working towards on title rather than a smalls team producing micro games to plug software drouts

@Souldin
It may be a fun game, but does it feel like metroid? Metroid had some frantic moments, but they were sparse and of a different nature.

Ultimately, would this game be better off as a new IP rather than being linked to metroid?

It could easily be a splatoon game, right?

Too bad. And here I am getting progressively curious about the title, ironically. Although it might be a while before my wallet and wishlist priorities will come together on this game, I'll check the demo at the very least. And I'm not even a Metroid fan, technically.

It'll be sad, however, if after these chart performance spawning "fans don't want it, give fans what fans want" speeches Nintendo makes a flagship Metroid game one day and it also shows underwhelming results. Or should I say "when", not "if"? After all - and I even see other folks pointing it out here - there are few more multifaceted, self-contradictory and chaotic concepts than "what fans want". And the bigger a fandom, the more kinds of Metroid Nintendo would have to make ideally. In practice, there will always be complaints. And honestly, video games are an interactive enough medium to detect objective flaws in - so is there anything unanimously lacking about the game that isn't "we never asked for it"? If companies only released the games fans asked for, we wouldn't have half the genres and staples and classics... we wouldn't have half the GAME INDUSTRY we have today.

It's funny that these beloved but niche franchises like Chibi Robo and Pikmin get side scrolling platformers (your definition may differ) to broaden their appeal, upsetting a section of the core fanbase in the process, while the one franchise that people would love to see get 2D side scroller gets an online co-op shooter instead.

I can't help but wonder if this game would have been better received if they had developed it as a new IP rather than attach the Metroid branding midway through development. Imagine if, through a bit of tinkering, Splatoon had been a new type of Metroid game. I expect people would have reacted similarly to the Federation Force reaction. The game could have been just as good as the Splatoon we got but would if have been as well received?

I just hope that Nintendo don't see these failed spin-offs as peoples indifference to the francises as a whole.

@Fuz Kinda sounds like YOU'RE entitled. Also, I don't consider Super Smash Bros. to be a spin-off of anything.

@nhSnork

The primary issue is though fans disagree on what a metroid game is or should be, they can greatly agree on what the series is not.

Metroid is not a squad based frantic multiplayer fps. If developers want to put out new ideas, they are usually overly welcomed to with new IP's.

Fans want that which lead them to be fans in the first place, which can differ between fans

@khaosklub Q) It may be a fun game, but does it feel like metroid?

A) The settings look like Metroid, and there are nice moments of tense music and empty landscapes as you go from one area to the next. It doesn't feel exactly like Metroid, from what I've played of Metroid games, but then the same I feel could be said when comparing the 2D and 3D Metroid games. Metroid Prime: Federation Force is a spin-off, so it would foolhardy to believe it'd feel exactly like a Metroid game. Heck, as alternative series example, I feel it took the 3D Mario series all the way up until Super Mario 3D Land/World to actually make a 3D Mario game that felt like a Mario game; an those 3D Mario games were main series entries.

Q) Ultimately, would this game be better off as a new IP rather than being linked to metroid?

A) I can see where that might have allowed people to warm up to it easier, but ultimately I'd say not. With Splatoon being an exception, new Nintendo IPs haven't been received too well this generation, and if it looked too similar to a Metroid game without being a Metroid game I could see even more criticisms forming.

I'm not a huge fan of Nintendo just making dozens of new IPs one after the other, particularly when a gameplay idea isn't distinct enough to need it's own basis in another IP. Nintendo are already juggling a roughly good hundred different IPs, and wishing to see each IP continue to foster is already taxing enough on my mind. I ultimately feel that the concept of Federation Force fits in well with the Metroid universe, and I've often seen fans consider the possibility of games centred around the Galactic Federation.

Q) It could easily be a splatoon game, right?

A) Hmm, that could have worked, obviously changing the themes and such. I would not have argued with a Splatoon themed game with the general concept of Federation Force, though it is good to see the Metroid series being remembered and put to use.

From what I hear, the ending teases events for a future game, so this might be an attempt (both externally and internally) to drive support for the creation and release of a new Metroid game. It isn't just a matter of convincing people to buy the game upon release, but also convincing people within a company that creating such a game would lead to people purchasing it. So that there might be an additional reason as to why the Metroid IP was used (if I remember correctly, I believe quite a few Nintendo games are conceived via the gameplay or mechanic first, and then has an appropriate IP attached or made for it).

@Dakt I actually had a real easy time finding people online, although I tested this out a couple days after launch.

I got Axiom Verge on day one, and finished it last night. It's simply one of the best games of this generation. It takes the classic Metroid formula and adds a ton of amazing twists, so much so that my internal monologue now is wondering whether it's actually better than Super Metroid.

Playing it made me incredibly happy, but also a bit sad, because that is exactly the kind of thing Nintendo should be pursuing with the Metroid franchise.

I'm not happy Federation Force failed, but I hope it leads to some lessons learned.

Metroid Prime Hunters: 6,810 units
Metroid Prime 3: 13,143 units
Other M: 36,164 units

To say the UK's relationship with Metroid is weird is an understatement.

welp well done guys, you only have yourselfs to blame if nintendo use the. we made x metroid game and it didn't sell, so we scrapped the metroid prime 4 game because of the sales.

also is this a complete picture? many people are buying games digitally these days, i have been doing a bit of both myself do they factor in eshop sales?

@ThomasBW84 I couldn't find this game. I first went to the locally owned new and used game store. They said they didn't have it, although they said they should be getting it soon. I went to Target, wasn't there. I went to Walmart, nope. I went to GameStop, they didn't have it either. I finally purchased it off eShop. I have gone back to these store since then seeing if they got a shipment, and no one has.

This could be one of the problems the game is facing. If you can't buy the game, it's not going to do well in the charts.

Can't say I am surprised. That's what you get when you make a game that nobody wants. Maybe Nintendo will listen a bit more to its audience

@Rogue76 It wasn't going to do great either way, might as well avoid wasting money overprinting it.

@Phil_Kavadias I think that's one of the main "problems" with Nintendo: they're a very creator-driven company. Federation Force only exists because it's Tanabe's pet project, nothing more or less than that. One could argue that they play it safe with their own franchises, but even Mario and Zelda mix up their respective formulas a lot compared to other AAA series, NSMB notwithstanding. Sometimes that "innovation" works, sometimes it doesn't.

Well, just as predicted this is going to end up being the same case as Codename STEAM. In that it flopped on the charts and soon enough, you could buy it for £10 sometimes a fiver.

But hey, at least we can all discover on our own if it really was a hidden gem or not when it becomes a cheap XMas stock filler in December.

Bad press or not, the game was still-born, and now the people that bought it will have a hard time actually finding others online, which further decreases the appeal of the game.
Personally, I'd have gotten the game if there was a decent solo, bt it doesn't even have that.

Gosh...!
A lot of dislikes about that game....
Even British people did too, not only Japanese gamers.

I'll probably get this sometime down the road. Hopefully, Nintendo doesn't shelve Metroid because of this... (And if they wanted to make a lot of money off a Metroid game, they should have worked with Doctor M64 and sold AM2R on the eshop!)

Stop producing games we don't want.

@khaosklub And in turn, they appeal to no one. Nintendo lost the casual market long ago.

Maybe start listening to what the fans want, Nintendo. No one asked for Federation Force so no one bought it.

Told ya! Rip Metroid.

"People are so quick dismissing stuff they don't want"
Excuse me ? I think that's the entirety of the point behind "not buying stuff"...

I find it incredible that people are trying to guilt trip others for not buying games that looked like games they wont enjoy...
"But it looks like a ton of fun !"
Sure, maybe, if you like multiplayer co-op FPS.

Its the exact same as with "Triforce Heroes".
It also was a multiplayer co-op focused game and it also didn't sell all that well, especially for a Zelda game.

Do people "hate" on that too ? Did they also not give it a proper chance ? Or maybe, juuuust maybe, is it, that this game format isn't all that popular on this platform / with the respective target audience ?

Both games reached out for the wrong people, especially Federation Force.
Maybe target people with shooter preferences. Make it a Splatoon spinoff. Don't target a fanbase, that is fond of claustrophobic, lonely, action adventures.

@jimi That's what I thought right off the bat, too. Download statistics for a free PC game being compared to a retail 3DS title. Lovely.

@Anti-Matter British people hate Nintendo in general. Even in the 90s, SEGA beat Nintendo and then Sony beat Nintendo from the PS1 onwards.

I bought it and it is really well done - better than expected. And I really appreciate that you can play it completely alone.

Don't understand why people hate it so much. Unfortunately if the sales figures stay that bad - I don't think that we will see a new Metroid game in the near future.

@Yasume
"No one asked for Federation Force so no one bought it"

Ya know, I get the whole " there has to be demand or won't sell" concept. But implying that Nintendo should only make games fans ask for is the worst idea I've heard, possibly ever.

How did people become fans of these franchises? They became fans because they made a new game or type of game and people liked it. Key words: new game or type of game. People would've never became vans of Metroid if Nintendo didn't invent a new game called Metroid. Fans never asked for that until Nintendo made something fans didn't ask for.

Fans only ever ask for more of the same. I pray to God that Nintendo never gets to the point where the start only making what fans ask for. We may have to deal with not getting the sequels we want when we want them but I'd rather deal with that the deal with never seeing anything new and only ever seeing sequels "fans ask for".

If it were up to "the fans" we'd just see straight up sequels for the rest of our lives of the games that already exist. No deviation to the left and no deviation to the right. Fans never asked for Metroid Prime, or Splatoon, or Luigi's Mansion which is probably the best spinoff ever created. So is the problem truly that Nintendo shouldn't make games fans don't ask for? Because I don't think that's the real problem. In fact I think that creates an even worse problem.

@SanderEvers That's because AM2R is completely free and is on PC, a far bigger platform than 3DS...if AM2R was $40 and on the 3DS, it wouldn't have sold as many copies.

Shame as it's a brilliant little game, just hope it hasn't put Ninty of the Metroid franchise.

I wouldnt even touch this monstrosity with my Gateway cart!!!

@fluggy
Its not a monstrosity. It's a decent game. It's not fantastic or super awesome, but it's not a bad game.

Definitely better than Triforce Heroes, that's for sure. At least this one can be played in single player

@JaxonH "If it were up to "the fans" we'd just see straight up sequels for the rest of our lives of the games that already exist."

Pretty much this.

Real shame. The game is just brilliant with tight controls and some rather impressive visuals (as one would expect from Next Level games). I actually greatly enjoyed this and my inner 11 year-old dreams came true as I actually felt like a Fed on dangerous missions against the vile Space Pirates. Oh well maybe this will be one of those titles that gets the recognition it is due when a few years have passed and the kneejerk reactions are long done (just like what has happened to Wind Waker, Deus Ex: Invisible Wars and many other titles that got this kind of fanboyistic fervor level of hate).

@SLIGEACH_EIRE "x game got what it deserved because I don't like it and I expect it to fail hard".

And you wonder what's wrong with videogame industry.

@Peek-a-boo don't be so dramatic

Meh, as expected.
Feel a little sorry for the devs of Feddy FoFo, but then I remember how awful the game was when I tried it.

It's simply not a 40$ buy from me... I'll definitely get it come the time it drops to 25$ or lower!

@RupeeClock
Actually, I wouldn't have minded it on 3DS if:
A) They had stylus control for non-New systems; the Gyro controls are awful and makes me want to beat the cheese out of random strangers with my 2DS.
B) Let Capcom make the game. Capcom makes THE best visuals on 3DS, whether or be realistic-style (Resident Evil and Monster Hunter) or toon-style (EX Troopers and Monster Hunter Stories). NO ONE can even come anywhere close to being as talented to them when it comes to 3DS, not even Nintendo nor Shin'en (okay maybe Sakurai). Not only that, Capcom has far more experience making co-op multiplayer games and shooting games, so they could've easily made a game about the space marines AND DO IT JUSTICE.

Good job everyone! That'll teach Nintendo to make a good game that isn't 100% conformed to your demands!

@kenrulei
Your comment reminds me of the same ignorant comment on the Facebook Nintendo Life topic.

Nobody wants it in Japan, in the UK, or the US. It's not like we didn't warn them. I think the overwhelming negative response from E3 all the way to the most recent game trailer before the release date should have been a clear as day sign for Nintendo. Too bad that the franchise will probably not see another title in a while or if ever, but I wasn't about to support something that clearly wasn't metroid.

One thing I find strange is that Nintendo is not even trying to advertise Metroid Prime Federation Forces at all here in the United States, MP:FF is not on any store adds, usually new released games are shown in the game/electronic section on store adds of Best Buy, Target, exc. MP:FF has had zero marketing.

@Souldin not played it yet as my copy is delayed (thanks Europe) but having gyro controls do think it would have done better if it was a Splatoon game instead??

@rushiosan I bought Star Fox Zero and I can honestly say it got what it deserved. I bought both the Collectors Edition and the regular game. The controls are beyond awful. Probably the worst controls I've ever experienced.

I don't own a 3DS so I can't say how MP: FF plays. But the visuals and sticking the Metroid badge on it annoy me. It's not a Metroid game.

@Grumblevolcano
I see...
I'm glad i wasn't born with mindset like that.
I feel blessed to be born with Nintendo lover mindset.
Because i love cute stuffs.

You know, I used to scoff at people saying "Nintendo fans are the worst". It's sweeping, it's dismissive, it's hyperbole, but...

comments and preemptive votes about this game and Star Fox by people who don't even try to enjoy a game connected to a franchise they claim to love. Don't even try. I'm not even talking try a demo, I'm talking don't even try mentally. Because they are sensitive and reactionary and entitled and think they know better and I truly don't know what reasons.

And they spit on dirty casuals, but you know what? That's what the negative side of a causal gamer is. They don't try. At the first hint of effort they bolt and write off a game as junk.

Fans who don't try. Maybe the worst. Only fans of what was, never fans of what could be. I mean what good are they to anyone? To Nintendo? To other fans? To other gamers? Maybe the worst. Could be.

Anyway, this just a post about what is hopefully a quickly passing disgust like when an awful revolting smell reaches your nostrils unexpectedly. Moving on and I'll try to forget it.

Such a shame... it wasn't all that bad of a game. The reason why they made this too was to help people see what the Federation really did. Perhaps they will play a bigger Roll in Metroid Prime 5?

@Meaty-cheeky I did see it on on the front shelves in various Gamestops (in CA) and a few large posters... but yeah compared to Pokemon or MH, not much!

I own StarFox Zero and I downloaded Metroid Prime Federation Forces the other day and I can tell you that MP:FF is a good game, unlike StarFox Zero which was truly an abomination in game controls.

@Einherjar Now i want a Splatoon online coop game. I really enjoyed the Splatoon single player and could imagine playing it as a coop as well

Yes it's not just Japan that this game flops !!!!

@RupeeClock im so happy that smt4 is still doing well

@aaronsullivan Used to do the same thing (I actually thought Sony fans were the worst for the longest time), but thanks to stuff like this and other crazy fan chest beating I now see why people strongly dislike Nintendo fans.

To those who have played it, how is the single player? I've seen some reviews say it is badly balanced and eventually becomes too difficult to complete on your own? Focusing on multiplayer at the expense of single player is a big turn off for me. I might have been more open to trying this if Triforce Heroes hadn't made me wary of what to expect.

Since when was not buying a game some kind of statement.
No one 'deserves' my hard earned money, so I'll spend it on games that I want to play or projects I think could use support.

@Sinister It would have been a perfect fit as a spin-off game.
Splatoon's singleplayer already set the theme, those "stealth" parts could have been squid sections. It would have worked wonders AND further promoted one of Nintendo's newer IPs and get more people interested in it that might not have had the opportunity to enjoy it on the WiiU.

And since it IS a new IP, its still up for experimentation.
Shoehorning it into an already established but completely famished franchise was a bad move no matter how you look at it.

@elekid It is very doable by yourself. The issue is much like Dark Souls or other games with a large co-op focus the difficulty can scale rather harshly at times by yourself. However if you enjoy a good challenge it is exceptionally doable on your own. Maybe watch a Let's Play or a stream if you feel unsure about the game balance.

@elekid You are correct, It's the Tri-Force Hero syndrome of the level designed built around multiple players rather than just single player.

It's not unfairly difficult by any means, but it's tedious.

Best example of this is a puzzle where you knock down four balls down a slope, with four players you have enough to only go down the slope once. With two you have to do it twice. If your alone... you have to go down the same route and back FOUR times. It's tedious, only get the game if you know someone who will play it with you.

@aaronsullivan If Nintendo wants money, then they need to release games that people actually want to play. It's not our responsibility to part with $40 to play games we don't like the look of.

They make something we want to play.
We give them money so we can play it.
That's how this relationship works, and no amount of inane banter about how "reactionary" or "entitled" gamers are is going to change that.

Federation Force will bomb and be largely forgotten, and people will continue to talk about and enjoy AM2R. If Nintendo doesn't get the message, then I'm sorry, but they deserve to lose money.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE I have both and I can safely say they're both good games. There's nothing wrong with SF Zero's controls, its only sin is being way too short, maybe that's why they put Guard in the same package. I'd kill for some DLC. The replay value, however, is the highlight.

Federation Force is a spin-off. It's a pretty fun game and a pretty good one on its own, but it requires and absurd learning curve for both Blast Ball and Solo modes. Like everyone say, it's meant to be a multiplayer experience. It NEVER was advertised as a main series entry neither a traditional Metroid game. It's like saying Dr Mario is a bad Super Mario game just because it's not a traditional side-scroller.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE

YOU don't consider? LOL. Sorry, the 3D Prime games are just as much Metroid as the 2D non-prime games. "Fans" like you are the worst of the worst.

@Wexter "but thanks to stuff like this and other crazy fan chest beating I now see why people strongly dislike Nintendo fans."

The annoying bit is normal Nintendo fans end up getting tarred with the same brush as the bedwetters, who in reality are just a vocal minority.

Its a shame really. Anyone watch SomecallmeJohhny? He recently reviewed this game and he put it best alone its kinda meh but with friends its a fairly decent game sorta like TriForce Heroes

That's a shame as its not a bad game in its own right despite its flaws. As my first into the Metroid universe, I was mildly surprised (bearing my wifi doesn't work on my 2ds at the mo so strictly sp for me) - visually it can be at times rather impressive (even on a 2ds) with some neat atmospheric moments & cool touches - mods & mech sidestep la Halo style.

Ball sections, pacing & difficulty spikes aside, it's occasionally enjoyable but it just doesn't do enough to hook or break the generic fps mold personally, as much as I enjoy SciFi/squad based premises. Had it been more tactical squad based like SW:Republic Commando (character backgrounds, personalities, issuing commands etc) with deeper lore it would have certainly helped me overlook its sp flaws.

@aaronsullivan If someone spends $40-60 on a game they probably wanted to like it

I'm not surprised. The game has not gotten much marketing from Nintendo, and the work that they have done to promote this game seems to miss the mark as someone who has completed the title. Instead, the game has been left to the fans and critic reviews, people that reject the game from the get go and people that have put out misinformation/lack of information with a low score attached respectively. I'm sure you'll be happy to report that Federation Force has flopped in North America when that information becomes available.

@elekid
The single player gave me almost exactly what I wanted to feel out of a Metroid Prime game on the go, and out of a Metroid game in general. Going alone, I recommend that you start the game without the Lone Wolf MOD (which doubles your attack damage, and ups your defense) and without Drones (which in most cases are there for extra fire power) just to see what it is like. I personally died on the first mission at the end, after exploring and battling for around 25 minutes, and I'm an experienced Metroid fan (completed all Metroid games).

I went back in though, did my exploring, did my combat and came out with success. Part of the reason why I went back in despite that early death was because, playing alone, I was reminded of the Metroid Prime experience. In fact, with the nearby waterfall and the snowflakes floating down, I was reminded of features that I like in Tallon Overworld and Phendrana Drifts. I still feel that way after playing Mission 1 numerous times.

As much as you hear that this is not a Metroid game, play it like a Metroid game and I think you'll come away with a good impression. Explore the areas that these missions take place in, and you'll reap the reward. If you're into the speed running aspect of Metroid, Federation Force will reward you for that play style as well.

Federation Force has its difficult moments in solo play, but as someone who has beaten the game solo and has gotten into the gameplay mechanics, I think you'll enjoy the experience.

I tried the demo and wasn't into it, I'm not a metroid fan in general though.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE
I would much prefer Metroid on console to be first person, the visors are a huge part of gameplay and it lends itself to Classic Metroid exploration. Handheld titles being 2D/2.5D is fine by me, it wouldn't require much in the way of graphics. But a 3D third person shooter game doesn't sound like what I want from Metroid. Not saying it wouldn't work, I could be wrong, but I feel first person is best. Although they should leave Prime behind and start a new story. No more phazon or dark Samus story, move it to another idea.

This is kind of like watching a train wreck. You know it's not going to be good, but you can't stop staring.

Next up, North America (I think). (o_O )

@I-U "I'm sure you'll be happy to report that Federation Force has flopped in North America when that information becomes available."

I'm sure they will. You do realise you're not allowed to enjoy Metroid Prime Federation Force?

@sr_388 It's not the fault of the consumer if a game fails to convince them to spend money on it.

@Classic603 I've said it for a long time that Metroid should have 3rd and 1st person views. Samus's abilities are severely gimped or else missing by being in first person only. And she loses her agility and speed.

@SLIGEACH_EIRE
What about Metroid Other M?

@Utena-mobile That's what I'm saying, take the best of Other M and Prime and roll them into one.

@electrolite77
I want them to cover how Federation Force is doing. I'm just saying that I think some of the staff are relishing in its failure, which is a bit irritating to me as I want to see Metroid and what it can be thrive.

I love Samus and can't imagine a Metroid game where we can't play as her. People may draw comparisons with Captain Toad Treasure Tracker, saying look, this is a Mario spin-off where you don't play as Mario.

But Mario has received plenty of core games and spinoffs that literally no one is saying we don't have enough Mario games with Mario in it. Metroid doesn't have that. If Nintendo had a decent number of Samus games, put out at a reasonable rate, then everyone would be ok with Federation Force. But that's not what Nintendo did.

I'm very sad. (T_T )

@SLIGEACH_EIRE I would be more than ok with that.
( ^_^)b

@I-U I see no evidence of the staff "relishing" in the failure of FF. Perhaps you should avoid articles like this if you're too sensitive to hear bad news about the sales of a game you like?

It's a shame. It's a good game, but I just wish I could play it kid Icarus style instead, because the controls are kind- of awkward.

Farewell, non-Smash version of Samus Aran.

@electrolite77 The snowflake part is a bit much, don't you think? That's usually an indicator of bait, or is used to attack those who don't believe in your opinion.

I have friends who loathe FF, and that's fine. I have friends who really like FF, and that's fine. Even got some who are down the middle, and find it meh. People need to respect others views more often, instead of hopping on the love/hate bandwagons for games. (It's to the point that saying a good thing about FF or a bad thing about Breath of the Wild can land you in a huge flame war in places)
Federation Force didn't appeal to that many people, and ended up taking a controversial turn, in my opinion. Not a good one, or bad one, just controversial, since it's argued and argued. Those thinking Metroid is dead now, that seems a tad much.

I feel sorry for those who wont give it a try, just because others wont. It is a very well crafted game, with nice graphics, controls and astonishing sound, especially when played with headphones. FYI I started with Metroid Prime on Gamecube. I prefer playing it solo, but also have tried out online, where you'll have to wait a bit to find someone because of the fact that not very much people own it. But I'm pretty sure, everyone who owns it, likes it. It it quite possible, that offering Blast Ball previously for free, was a bad move, which made even more people turn their backs on it, because IMHO Blast Ball is a pretty stupid game. Federation Force is a great game though, and actually i will play it again right after writing this although i have an enormous count of alternatives.

@MarcelRguez Amen.

@elekid The single-player is bland but, in my experience, I never had too much trouble to 100% it solo on normal mode. Some medal requirements are more strict than others (whomever came up with that cute 'don't let any balls be destroyed' in mission 2 should be shot), but it's never that big of an issue if you're not going for 100%.

@BlueKnight07 Can't argue with someone with Falco as their avatar

@aaronsullivan 10/10 post

@Fuz "Reminds of when Prime was first announced: 'oh no, they've turned our beloved franchise into yet another FPS!'. Also the hatred towards the graphical style of Wind Waker."

The hatred towards both of those games was STRONG. IGN was struggling to control the whining on their message boards.

Most Metroid fans have simply wanted a 2d Metroid with a map on the bottom screen since the DS came out. Never happened.

@electrolite77 Just because a* game doesnt fit into what you want to doesn't mean it's a terrible game and should fail. Nintendo made a good game but because it isn't the Metroid game that people are demanding, the majority want it to fail.

@WiltonRoots Remember DMC4? "Oh, no who is this guy who is not Dante! Oh, they are shoehorning in a Raiden character into DMC!" It happens to every franchise. Granted when it happened to DMC: DMC it did kind of deserve it considering the final product.

@Lizuka To play devil's advocate, if a free demo is out, that at least deserves to be given a shot. And also, "Business needs to adapt to the consumer, not the other way around" should not necessarily mean that only the ideas of the fans should be acted on. Listening to fans is great, but at some point you'll just be making more of the same over and over. Taking risks and making something new every once in a while is nice. That's not even taking into account at ALL about how that limits the author's creative freedom.
Nobody should be forced to buy a game just because it's in a franchise they like, but I don't think not taking risks would be the right answer. FF was just a risk that didn't pay off, that's all.

@electrolite77 No problem, man. There should be a demo on the eshop still, actually. From what I hear, F-Zero was less of a sales issue but more of just "What can we actually do with this?" for some reason. They really should just look to Shin'en or someone.

@sr_388 Nintendo made a good game
Disagree.

@sunrisensoul From what I hear, F-Zero was less of a sales issue but more of just "What can we actually do with this?" for some reason
Nah, that's the official excuse. F-Zero GX, a big collaboration title between Nintendo and Sega (and one with a high budget at that), didn't reach 750000 units sold. It totally was a sales issue, no matter what Miyamoto said about it.

Shame. This won't help encourage Nintendo to make a more standard Metroid game like many think. It'll encourage them to ignore the franchise even more as one people don't want anymore. Especially after Other M also being poorly received.

@WiltonRoots
Hatred towards those games are still pretty strong.

I've gotten used to windwakers graphics, but honestly, it's not a very good game. The dungeons werr okay, but there were too few, and most of the game was a snore, even with fast sailing.

And prime, I like, but it's not what fans wanted. Hate died down a bit as those fans were given fusion and zero mission, but those fans haven't gotten a new game since then, and now that castlevania has gone lords of shadows, there are only a few subpar indie games and axiom verge scratching that metroidvania itch.

And then people wonder why the fans are so aversive to things like federation force. We're seeing a beloved genre all but dissappear. This is the same thing happening to the prime series

@EVIL-C
And what kind of fans are the best? Those with no standards? Fans are fans for a reason, and those who got on the metroid train back in the NES days probably stayed for the gameplay, since exposition was nonexistant at the time. To those fans, there was nothing more than the platforming, exploration, powerups and search for secrets.

The popular super metroid had a prominant story, which some fans liked more than the gameplay. If you love fps' s and love the metroid lore, then prime was your wet dream. But believe it or not, but some people don't like fps' s! Those metroid fans will not like prime, because it's a vastly different game!

@khaosklub Bringing in standards into things is very iffy, since it mostly is just used as "My opinion is better than yours!" and stuff like that. It's incredibly subjective over what is good or not, and fans should NOT just be some group of people who all think the same thing about something, whether it be taking in anything new without criticism or pushing away everything new. Fans are just people who like something, and should have opinions independently of whatever group they're in. If they agree, then cool. If not, then also cool.
I respect your opinion of course, of not being a fan of Federation Force, but I don't agree with what you said about it disappearing. I also do not like how fanbases have been acting in general since 2010. You don't have to buy the newer games or sidegames, they don't threaten the rest of the series. All they do is have the chance to bring people into the series that normally haven't been interested or heard of it. Just see the effect that Prime had. Having people like or dislike different things only makes the fanbase more interesting. It's why Pokemon is so refreshing, with people liking different generations more.

@khaosklub I've gotten used to windwakers graphics, but honestly, it's not a very good game. The dungeons werr okay, but there were too few, and most of the game was a snore, even with fast sailing.
Good Lord, THANK YOU for that. It's like they tricked people with the artstyle, I thought I was taking crazy pills.

@Yorumi The only "bad fans" are those who don't respect the opinions of others, honestly. If you look at some metroid fansites, there are people who loathe the game and love it interacting just fine. Differences are great, since it allows different ideas to flow and come out. It's been great to see the debates over what people like or didn't like about games in general, especially since it makes it even better for someone who is in the middle about getting it or not.
It's only when people think that certain opinions are "wrong" that things start to flare up.

@mcgrewpunk
There was a fourteen year gap between new 2D Mario and DKC games

Despite the bad reception from the internet, I'd wager this is mostly due to factors like Nintendo not being very popular in UK, and little to no actual marketing being done for the game. Are we really still supposed to believe that all of a sudden Nintendo is going to come out swinging with the NX and they're going to do great with it when it looks like they're barely trying to be relevant with the systems they're supposed to be currently supporting?

I think I've mentioned before, but the thing is... I'm just not interested in Federation Force. I simply don't care. I wouldn't call myself a "hater", and I highly admire Next Level Games as a developer. (Punch-Out!! Wii is one of my favorites on that console.) But nothing about this game strikes me as something I would love. Nothing about it grabs me. Absolutely nada. I have played demos and--to that end, at least--given it a fair chance. But I just wasn't ever taken by it. I think I might get it when it's under a fat discount, but... I just can't be bothered for now, unfortunately.

Incidentally, I have played Star Fox Zero and gave it a few earnest chances. It left me very cold and unimpressed, so take from that what you will!

This comment sections schadenfreude level is over 9000!!!

@electrolite77 That's a great quote!

@aaronsullivan
The simple fact of the matter is gamers are spoiled for choice now. If FF were the only game released this year I might think, "well, it doesn't really look like my kind of game, but I'll give it a chance." As it is though there are so many other games that do look appealing to me that I'd rather spend my money and limited gaming time on. I'm a big Metroid fan but FF doesn't look interesting to me, so I won't give it a chance just because Nintendo made it and it has Metroid in the name. There are so many other games that I'd rather take a chance on.

@ricklongo I was on the fence with getting Axiom Verge now because it seems a bit expensive for an indie eshop game, but you've convinced me to get it.

@ElementSponge I see it more as "I told you so" than schadenfreude.

Good, this game doesn't deserve anything other than to flop.

@ElementSponge hahaha, the very next comment after my reply to you would seem to prove you right

Nintendo learns a lot of lessons the hard way...

I think I might be in some kind of minority, because I hate Federation Force, but love Star Fox Zero. (I don't find the controls bad at all, they're very responsive and allow you to do things that you couldn't do with traditional controls)

A real shame, I'm enjoying this a lot so far and it has great production values. And despite the chibi visuals it does really feel like a Prime game in my opinion. A bit like how Persona Q feels like P3 and P4 once your eyes adjust a little.

@3MonthBeef Really? The game has one of the most in depth control and combo system for any game ever made. The fact that Nero and Dante both play very distinct from each other while at the same time each one of Dante's Devil Arms having their own style and combos is intense. However, I can understand why someone can dislike the game. The simple fact that Dante has to literally retread the ground you just covered as Nero is just silly and really lazy. The game does have a very good reason for being that way as Capcom cut the development time from two years to one mid way in development and they had to push it out.

DMC4 could have surpassed DMC3 if Capcom had not stuck their vile fingers into the developers plan and vision.

@khaosklub which is all the less reason to heed fans. Super Mario Bros wasn't a racing game or a tennis game. Pokemon wasn't a dungeon crawler or a fighting game - heck, none of the major Nintendo franchises were fighting games. Legend of Zelda wasn't a hack'n'slash. Final Fantasy wasn't a turn-based tactic game or a fighting game or a rhythm game. Castlevania wasn't an expansive action-adventure like Metroid. Metroid itself wasn't an FPS to begin with. So how many games and series wouldn't have seen the light of day if this logic was applicable? Thank goodness it isn't - at least beyond the traditionally egocentric and shortsighted realm of fan mentality.

I'd remotely understand the concern if Nintendo said all Metroid games from now on would be like Federation Force. But this game has "spinoff" written all over it in neon. And spinoffs' primary value is to take the factual IP where the flagship games wouldn't. Telling them to be their own IPs is missing the point, and financially, the chance of them attracting new gamers who weren't sold on the series in its usual guise is worth a lot more than constantly catering to oldschoolers, genwunners and whatnot. Even MPFF's case of underwhelming sales doesn't undermine this principle in general since the track record of successes trumps it. This industry, like many other incarnations of commercial fiction, earns its bread and wine among audiences, not among fans.

@nhSnork
Eloquently put

@samuelvictor A curious point I must add, I have been reading people who seem offended the game uses "Metroid Prime" in the title, and something I also stated in my review: this IS a "Metroid Prime" game, in fact a direct follow up plotwise after the events of "Metroid Prime 3 Corruption". You just happen not be in the awesome chozo boots of Samus Aran.

@ElementSponge "This comment sections schadenfreude level is over 9000!!!"

Absolutely oozes it. There'll be champagne bottles popping amongst the usual suspects once the US charts come in. Followed by cries of "This is what happens when you don't give the fans what they want!" Not saying I can see into the future or anything...

@nhSnork Well put.

@GauBan Q) Do you think it would have done better if it was a Splatoon game instead??

A) Done better in terms of being received better and selling better; yeah, I think it would. I personally am happy it is connected to Metroid as it explores the concept of playing as a Federation Force soldier and uses an IP that gone without a game for a little while (compared to other Nintendo IPs, six years isn't much), but the concept of a 3DS team based shooter could have easily worked whilst using the IP of Splatoon. It wouldn't have the same baggage of expectations as what has come about with the Metroid IP, with criticisms to the graphical design and tone as well as the lack of a recent mainline entry, and would be able to ride off on the success that Splatoon has enjoyed with it's not too long ago release.

Alternatively, the game could have also been received better through some adjustments to the graphics and tone, but would probably still be slandered for being a spin-off rather than a mainline Metroid.

@3MonthBeef I can understand that. I love DMC4 because the combat is so polished to a near perfect shine! Though, it sucks that it is a game that gives you so many tools, but not a big enough box to play with them in. Also the final boss is just epic! Though DMC3 and Virgil still tops it

@Souldin I feel that the main problem had with Federation Force was the fact it was a Metroid Game without Samus. You could still play her in Metroid Prime Hunters.

Still not got my copy yet. (Thank Bexit and the French).

Anyway maybe they will re-skin it for a Splatoon game and see how quick it sells.

I was going to buy it (I was on the edge, but I was going to buy it) I went to Best Buy on the day it released(I'm in the USA) and they were sold out. I went to Walmart the next day and they were sold out. The next week I checked Best Buy again and Walmart again, both sold out. Last week I tried Best Buy again and it was sold out again.
Yes I could order it, but I haven't each time I was at those stores for a different reason with some time to kill THAT NIGHT so waiting a few days to get one in the mail didn't ever make sense.
I think it's very difficult for a game to sell well if it's not sitting on the shelves.

@nhSnork
Mario kart isn't a mario game. Would the game be worse off if it was an original IP? Did wave race need mario characters? It could easily have been a mario spin off game.

Those games would have likely existed anway, but like smash bros, known characters were put in to help make the game popular.

There is also the fact that mariokart did not replace mario platforming games. They were still producing the 2D mario platformer games that fans actually wanted.

Super mario 64 worried some fans, because it too was a departure from the gameplay they had come to play.

This is also why fans draw the distinction between 2D mario games and the 3D mario games.

Mario maker is great for 2D mario fans, but you can't expect 3D mario fans to be satisfied with it because it's a "mario" game.

Should fans be happy if nintendo stops releasing mario platforming games and focuses on sport spinoffs? Should they buy mario badmitton 3: birdo's birdie, in hopes that a new mario game that they actually want might be made?

Case in point, there is already a beloved nintendo series that was replaced by it's more popular spin off. Wario land is dead, and they are just now releasing a classic wario amiibo for mario part. Warioware, a spinoff party game has proven more lucrative. No matter how many copies of warioware everyone buys, nintendo will not release wario land 5.

Capcom did it well, every new mechanic was an entirely new series somewhat related.
Mega man, mega man X, mega man legends, mega man battle network, all very different games, all distinctly different series's.

@sunrisensoul
By standards, I mean, you have your opinion, and refuse to accept something that isn't up to your standards.

Federation force may be good, but to many fans, it's not good enough.

A lot of people saying to give it a chance are telling those with standards to settle for less.

For some people, federation force meets their standards, they just have lower standards, and can't accept that others have higher standards.

@khaosklub Mega Man might be an ironic example for you to use, seeing as its flagship series did adopt a slower release pace among the abundance of spinoffs as well. But among the latter, I'm not even sure if X and Zero changed the formula THAT much. Super Mario 64 is an evolution product rather than spinoff (2D to 3D transition has had enough neighsayers as well, but the reality is, everyone and their dog tried it during the fifth generation, thinking it was THE THING - and Nintendo made a notorious enough attempt to influence others), although I must agree that applies to my Castlevania example from above, too. In yet more irony, some of actual SMB spinoffs were actually conventional 2D platformers... a shoot'em up stage here and there notwithstanding. XD That includes Wario Land which offered comparatively more familiar gameplay than WarioWare. Maybe that factored into comparative sales, too? Like I said the other day, it can be hard to predict what sales a company will consider satisfactory at a given time, but two chicks laying golden eggs gotta be better than one. So was it about WarioWare selling better or about Wario Land simply falling that far behind? You not being Nintendo, I don't demand an answer from you, but I believe this is also a point to consider. And another point is creative work. New games can take time as developers figure out where to move and what to offer next - which, while seemingly not always, can be an important thing for the companies as well. Not everyone can successfully pull off a Capcom and sell six games on one platform with [relatively/arguably] minor tweaks to the recipe. XD But is it better to leave the resulting release gap empty or fill it with some experiments on the side?

And what you don't account for while advocating "separate IPs for separate experiments" is the kind of inspiration that can come from translating the existing gameplay and fictionverse staples into a new genre. Character and enemy specifics, item specifics, lore specifics, environment specifics - you name it. If Mario Kart wasn't a Mario franchise game, would it have necessarily had all the features that became iconic in the series and mirrored by many other kart racing games of the kind? Would Super Smash Bros have popularized massive multicrossover games if it hadn't shown the potential of compiling diverse movesets, arenas and tactics stemming from diverse source games? And if Symphony of the Night had been a separate IP, would it have helped define and christen "metroidvania" subgenre or just mimicked Metroid for a follow-the-leader investment (possibly even set in space, too)? Again, not every such spinoff is bound to be successful, innovative or influential by default. But the general harvest outweighs the weedwork by far. So it's not about meeting spinoffs during a long flagship break with obligatory delight, it's about not diminishing spinoffs' worth just because "you're not a pony!" as one fan animation character said angrily. This worth can have more impact in the long run than the worth of making a crowd of fans relive the nostalgia. Not that it should discourage developers and publishers from flagship releases - and by my impression, more often than not it doesn't.

@samuelvictor the frustration with the predicament you describe is understandable, but it's not the end of the world (or even any official end of the franchise), so acting insulted and denying the game the right to exist is rather unacceptable. Besides, Nintendo keeps tight-lipped even about its around-the-corner nextgen products these days, so does no lip service to games in development even guarantee there are NO games in development as we speak? If the development is taking its sweet time, would an early announcement thrown to angry/hungry folks as a bone help the matter or simply generating premature sandcastle-prone hype that could backfire upon said flagship game's release later? So basically if our distress as fans doesn't matter (which is what I have long come to believe in but I'm aware that a number of people in the industry beg to differ), it's no big deal, and if it does matter, our behavior already makes it too much of a bomb to risk mishandling further. ¯(ツ)/¯

The flak the game gets is really a shame, but it's sadder that Nintendo is even supposed to try and maneuver around such publicity somehow. Especially when the controversy stems from a largely trivial point. Again, disappointment is fully legit here. Overreaction and attempting audience meddling isn't.

@tedko @MarcelRguez @electrolite77 @Rocossa @Ralizah @Wexter
On my admittedly melodramatic and somewhat disingenuous post: I did try to make the point that it was just a somewhat irrational reaction I was having: a passing disgust. I know it was a limited and simplistic view.

I agree with @tedko the most. Those who are saying "make something we wanna buy and we will" are really, really missing my point and probably a bit in denial, but I can't judge that through the screen. If you bought a game and you "proved" to yourself that you didn't like, well that still doesn't exempt you from my point, but boy do I not want to get into that. There are so many choices now, why should a gamer care, really? A question for every gamer that is worth answering for themselves.

Thing is, there's no way around the fact that Nintendo has issues in the managing of its fan base. It does need to know its core customers who are fans now and needs to maintain their trust. Nintendo also has a group of disenchanted possibly angry "fans" that it needs to decide how to handle. Possibly dump them for good. Possibly cater to them and try to regain their trust. I don't think it's a forgone conclusion which is the best choice for Nintendo, their other fans, or gaming in general.

@nhSnork
I would call smb3 an evolution to smb, while smb is a spinoff of mario bros, which may be a spinoff of donkey kong.

A game is fundamentally it's mechanics. Evolution would be an improvement on those mechanics. Like street fighter 1 to 2.

Super mario 64, mechanic wise is completely different, particularly because of the 3D element. Tekken is not the evolution of street fighter, nor was street fighter ex, they're completely different games.

"So was it about WarioWare selling better or about Wario Land simply falling that far behind?"
Replace warioware with federation force and wario land with metroid Prime, and you've just justified the backlash from prime fans.

Splatoon did well, without familiar character, while dinosaur planet didn't with familiar characters. Why is that? Dinosaur planet wasn't a very good game, nor was it a starfox game. Splatoon was a great game advertised well.

Mariokart could have done well as an original IP, with items that behaved the same way. Heck, it could have even had mario items, just new unique characters.

Smash bros might not have done well without the various characters, but what game is smash a spinoff anyway? It could be argued that it is a unique IP, it just features characters from nintendo games. I mean, is marvel vs capcom a mega man spinoff game?

Would epic yarn done better without kirby? Would symphony of the night do better as bloodstained? Would mega man X do better as mega man 7? There are examples on both sides, but games like symphony of the night are somewhat dishonest. People may have went in expecting an evolution of super castlevania 4's gameplay, which revolved around a whip mechanic... though you could play as richter, so it could be considered a proper sequel. It is eventually castlevania 1 with additional features.

Mega man 1 through 6 were vastly different, making great innovations to the base mechanic. Sliding and charged shots greatly changed the game, though the base mechanics and graphics were identical. Each street fighter numbered game was greatly different from the previous one, though general base mechanics were the same.

Sequels suggest the mechanics you enjoy. Tetris 3 would not make sense as a fighting game. It's not about nostalgia. People like a game series for a reason. They like the mechanics, otherwise they won't play much of the game. When you give them another game of the same title, they expect the same mechanics.

While federation force takes the combat mechanics of the prime games, and perhaps builds upon it, but the fundamental mechanic of the game is squad based combat... which is not considered a core mechanic of metroid prime. You may individually prefer squad based combat, but if you are a metroid prime fan, that certainly isn't what you play prime for. And you may even like squad based combat mechanics more than the standard prime mechanics, but it is a shame for this to be called "metroid prime", is just a slap to the face of metroid prime fans, and threatens the future of primes mechanics as fans know and love. Squad combat may become metroid prime's new core mechanic.

Calling it federation force (maybe added the pretext: metroid prime's rather than just metroid prime, though preferably not), or making it a new IP would at least not threaten the hope of getting a new game with metroid prime's core mechanics.

@KO-Cub i don't use facebook so i wouldn't know,, but yeah i seen the eshop sales. but then again metroids never done big numbers either, it's why it's not a constant series like zelda mario pokemon. we'll likely see more splatoon games than metroid ones tbh.